Yestardays Raid... Your thoughts?

We talkt a bit yesterday about the raids online but now it have sunkt in a bit and i thought it would be nice to hear what you all think?

Me myself thought it went pretty well some wipes in the beguining but for our first run not so bad at all..... Some of use got gear (Or maybee it was just me) but we all learn the tactic and we got the first Raid nerv gitters out of the way (Again maybee just me). Unfortunatly we hade som Pug´s real IRL Noobs but we manage... it will defenently be more fun ones we get a strait guildrun going whitout pugs.

So what do you all think?

Well as for me in general it went OK. Could have been a LOT better but in the end it will be!
I would say that highlight of yestrday evening was that druid tank guy we met, he really seems nice enough fellow and he is straight forward with a sense of humor to boot. WTB buy him in our guild, will chat with him when I get him on line:)

I am sorry Sil wasnt there, since I got used to him and his Off tanking, we did one VoA run together and it went great even though neither of us had the proper requirements for raids..... Regardles there will be other times

But now a few wievs from tanking point:
Most of people still need to learn to stay behind the tanks while going in uncharted teritory, I have found out that mobs there have much wider aggro radius, and people need to remember to give tanks a few secs to build aggro and position the mobs otherwise will get run about as we did with second boss on the first try!

All in all trash was easy enough, for the first boss we need to get some bearing but all in all was fine , second boss easy, now the third boss,....
That fight is hardest on healers I think, some webings and adds are not the problem, but healers need to get the MT topped at all times otherwise I wont survive regardles of my gear (guess thats the reason of recomended 3 healers). Now I know Aka gear is all right and he can only get better in raids, didnt check that Pallys gear anyone have comment on that Basicly i read something about the fight and its basicly I need to stay alive during that stun period or it is wipe, nothing more just that!

As for PuG people some IRL noobs some ok guys, that other pally OT we found was good also, anyone remember his name BTW?

Main issue and problem are healers, some druid wisp. me yestrday and I put him on friends but still big shortage of healers for our guild! Will be even harder when Aka goes.... But until then we must use him to the best of ours and his abbilities

EDIT: did anyone took any screenies?

Nice one guys!
How did you do?

Ive geared my warrior up quite nicely now, good enough for 25man naxx

Going to try and get a guild(maybe few PuGs, met a nice healer last night) 10man going tonight, hopefully will get that cleared and some nice loot

Keep it up guys!!

Thx raw...

And yes i took some screeners ... maybee i should have focust on my DPS insted... I post them later tonight whene i get home.
I have to go now i have some work stuff to do but later during my lunch i will post some thought from my point of wiev...

Now i have more time so here it comes...

After yesterdays run i found some weakness and strengths whit my raid mage spec. I give ok DPS right now but when I get better gear it will go up. However my casting time is about 3 sec and right now im going for Hit and SP in my gear. To maximize my DPS I need to do a rotation of living bomb-scorch-scorch-FFB-….. And refresh living bomb and scorch buffs when needed. So I have a bit of a workup before I start giving good DPS. This is no problems against bosses and the overall switching of targets is not a problem as well if the targets have a lot of HP. When bosses span small mobs (Not elite) I think blizzard is the best approach. Yesterday when they started spanning I start potting blizzard near or on Akari which I think worked well (Any thoughts?). Blizzard have a descent dps and a large area so its good for small swarming mobs I think.

This is just what I learned yesterday and will adapt myself and my spec as well if need be to be more mobile. But the optimal for me is hitting large mobs or bosses over an extended period.

But as I mentioned at the beginning this is just my strengths and weaknesses. I will ofc do what is needed in raids even if im not optimized to handle it...

Another thing about the looting if we use a master looter. I would be good to wait a while befor calling a roll so every one have time to see the stats and see if they need it or not and after the roll i cald wait a while and them enitiat a count down like 5.... 4..... 3.... And so on. Therby thers no confusion about when the roll is finiched and the winner is cald...

OHH BTW the sword incident workt out so i now have it .... Thx again Akari...

I'm gonna get me pally alt in the guild this evening and start hammering up the levels with him, then spec as needed - as and when needed

.....and we are beginning to *need* a vent server - I'll have a look around a bit later and see what's available.

I realy enjoyed the raid. Granted i may of let my temper rise a lil bit, but hey, you poke a bear - prepare to be bitten

Apart from the the randoms that left over and over, i think it went realy well. We had all the important roles covered by guildies, which means WE actualy can raid.

Now that we all know the tactics, we can start farming the spider wing for gear !


Oh and by the by.....i spoke to a GM....he gave that sword to Leah! So yeah, all worked out in the end. Sorry again Leah.


Congrats all!

I don't want to be negative... but it's important to remember that:

1. We were a hair's breadth close to wiping at one point when we took down the first boss. Teshija's health was so low that I was sure that he had died and it was just the few seconds lag which did not make him appear as "dead".

2. The difficult work of bringing the adds down to ~10% at the second boss, yet not killing them, was done by the rogue we PuG'ed.

3. As Heavy said maybe we were overall low on dps. Wowwiki says the Maexxna fight should last 2-3 mins ... with us it was over 5 mins before we wiped.

However it could have been worse
.... we could have wiped on the first pull for example .................

No seriously ... next time it should be better

Absolutely correct Twila - Couldn't agree more.

Altho it'd be nice to have everyone geared up correctly, its gona be rough starting raiding - Always is.

My point being that we played with randoms, we've never done it before and we were at it for a good chunk of time.

I my self was trying to get in sync with the paly healer - As you saw on the first boss where tesh nearly died.
Should i have stacked more hots before moving and healing the OT? Yes. And i did the next time - It went smoother.


But even if we manage to scape by and down 1 boss, imo, its still worth it. Aslong as we're learning, gearing up and having fun.

Akaris wrote:But even if we manage to scape by and down 1 boss, imo, its still worth it. Aslong as we're learning, gearing up and having fun.

agreed

[quote="Twila"]I don't want to be negative... but it's important to remember that:
1. We were a hair's breadth close to wiping at one point when we took down the first boss. Teshija's health was so low that I was sure that he had died and it was just the few seconds lag which did not make him appear as "dead".
quote]

Well could not agree with you more....

The reason this is I bealive was pally healer. See when I run from the boss i try to get away from that locust swarm thingy and while it lasts boss is 30 % slower so its easy to outrun when you get the hang of it BUT while running my back is turnd towards the boss and practicly until he hits me I didnt know where the swarm will end, and since he hits me in the back I cant dodge, parry or block so two strikes and I am screwed, the pally was to slow with heals I guess saw that on last boss as well after stuns! We wiped first time didnt expect it, ok second time too, next time after every single stun I poped one CD either defensive or selfhealing what seemed best at the moment but on the lust stun all my CDs were off and I died...... SImple as that just was not healed fast enough. Now I know that aint Akas Faoult couse his HoT lasted through stun so the only thing left in equation is pally, he/she just wasnt as good healer I think, or missing in gear.

Gearwise I should survive Nax 10 without any problem at all:
nearly 27 k HP unbuffed
553 def (540 def minimum for not being critable by bosses)
way more than 50% added up from dodge, parry, block

As for second boss we should be more clear in explaining tacts, I mean Zu nocked down all for the second try lol , so better explanation will be needed (pers got us a Ventserver so it should be easier a bit). Also the 3 of us explained the tacts at the same time, and I use my privilige as guild master to kill off this practice in the future, I know we all tried to help but in the end I think it only added to confusion. SO in the future I would like just one of us to carefuly get down tacts and explain them, that person should act as raid leader and I would prefer to be one of DPSers, Tanks and healers have enough on their mind + if unexpected pull happens and we are typing we are screwed more times then not. I hope for volonteer work here:)

One more thing:
Please check all your gear and related sites for gear and what you should have for raids. Look for upgrades in rep rewards, crafting proffesions and heroics. Me, Aka, Zu and Sil know pretty much every instance from heart by now and runs are a breeze most of the time so all you lacking use us for your benefit. There is a post in instance thread where you can post your wishes so we can maximaze no of runs / efficency.

Obviously not raid specific (not even WoW specific in fact) but some good points are being put forward here and these might help (or at least back up what's been said already)

In my experience from playing Eve a couple of things were taken for granted in the way things are organised:

1) One person and one person only calls the shots - ever - and his/her word is law. It's a lot of responsibility for one person to take on but it really is the only way to effectively co-ordinate a big group of people.

I kid you not when I say that, with the corp/alliance I was in in Eve, Fleets of several hundred players was not unusual - an reasonable size average gang used to be abot 40 or so. Communication in those circumstances was paramount, more than one 'leader' was a sure sign of failure.


2) Voice comms is *essential*, hence the vent server if we're growing as a guild we need our facilities to grow with us. Even if you're a bit shy and don't like to talk - you gotta be able to listen, and by listen I mean listen

In the infrequent situation where not everyone was on vent, the leader designates one person to be 'typer' and relay the spoken messages via text chat to those who can't hear. One person only does this no matter how 'helpful' it might seem to jump in and add something to the conversation.


3) Tempers can run high in the heat of the moment, that's all fine no problem it's part of what happens in these situations - don't take offence even if someone is screaming blue murder at you (I'm expecting this to happen to me a lot until I get a feel for what I'm doing as healer/whatever)

4) Point one was the most important - I can't stress how important it is that everyone shut up when the leader is talking. Even if he doesn't have a tactic, or yours are better or whatever - shut the hell up and listen.

5) Even more important than point one, have fun and enjoy it (but still learn to listen ).

My 2c now

From my point of view it was a good run. Pity we couldn't get full guild run as we wasted good 2h (we spent 4.5h in total there) looking for OT, DPS or healer.

1. First OT was bit undergeared (lvl70 epics) but skilled and it was nice to have him there Nice chap overall I hope we'll catch him again Another good tank (from my point of view) is Milkyme - tauren druid (34k hp in bear form). We run (me, Aka and pug dpss) timed Strat and few other HCs (Aka got dragon btw gz again mate ) with him earlier on today. We might keep an eye on him too if we'll have problems with OT again.

2. DPSs - some of pugged DPSs were slacking big time on dps. We were not great either but 900dps is way below limits here (we as guild were at 1.8-2.0k mark overall I think). On this strat timed runwe also had T7.5 geared dps (feral druid in cat form) dealing some sick DPS I have his name on my friends list (his guild cleared all 25 man stuff hence his gear...) and maybe we'll manage to get him on board for some runs if we need dpss.

3. Healers - very hard to find good healer and with healers rotation we had (we had 3 or 4 diffeent heales?) it was probably hard for Aka to sync with them. I don't know any good healers atm (apart from Aka the Wise ) so we will have to pug them again untill some of us will get our healers to 80 (Pers, Gredeth, me)

4. Tactics - Tesh is correct here. It was a bit messy yesterday. I'm more than happy to explain tacs but I can only share what I read in guides and now from a bit of xp gained in first wing. I can also take care of master looter (like yesterday) if needed unless we have other volunteers

On last boss - we almost got this spider down and if not for the fact we were 9 man it (rogue went offline) we could have done it as boss was left there with 10% hp or so before we wiped. This 1 missing dps burried us yesterday on last attemtp.

Overall - great fun, lots of experience on bosses in this wing, way too much time wasted for looking for healers, OT and DPSs Nothing we can do about it unless we will have enough people in guild to cover all major roles. DPSs can be easily PUGged but it's hard to pug good OT or healer

Can't wait for our next run lads I think we've done well taking in account who we pugged with (some of them... well, no comment)

I totaly agree whit pers point 4 bouth in chatt and vent chanel aspacialy in vent when you have maybee 1 second delay so conversation is realy hard if your a group so when orders are given all best be quiet.... And in the chat chanel its realy hard to read when the text flach down constantly...

Saying this we most also remember this is fun and maybee you feel like blowing of some steam during the raid if so do it after the fight... or the looting...

As for the rest of the points i allsaw agree and they feel rather self explanatory....

Very good points Buc + Pers.

One thing note with the added bonus of Vent si that, it allows the raid leader to focus on the raid. Not typing, not waiting for replys, not checking gramar / spelling - You speak. They listen. Simple.

4 hours of typing tactics + underrstanding them enough to type them out is gona be hard on anyone.

We were not great either but 900dps is way below limits here

Wow, that's some poor DPS, even I do more at lvl 72

Sounds like a lot of fun and tbh I really really really can't wait to get there. I read quite a bit about shaman gears for heroics and raids and a couple of people said that level 77-80 blues are enough for heroics, is this true or not? I'll be sure to get decent gear anyways before even attempting raids, though.

I found a good site with a complete list of fairly easy-to-obtain items which will be enough to get me started, so all I need to do now is level up, up, up.......

Oh and this may be very obvious but I'll remind just in case: melee DPS stay behind the target, that way your attacks can't be blocked or parried (can be dodged though) and will boost your DPS greatly.

Not much of an advice, self-explanatory actually

[quote="Gredeth"]

Oh and this may be very obvious but I'll remind just in case: melee DPS stay behind the target, that way your attacks can't be blocked or parried (can be dodged though) and will boost your DPS greatly.

Not much of an advice, self-explanatory actually

hmmm I think I read somwhere that mobs are not affected by this rule a few days ago.... Might be mistaken but I am pretty sure I have seen it.

Yep blues should be enough for heroics I started with bluus some greens and epic boots and helmet from BS which BUc made me, I am a tank though so felt more secure with some boosted gear but as a DPS blues should be fine I think!

One think i like to add that might be self explanetory is that everyone should at least try to read up a bit on Tactic before the run. It might be hard to understanding everything but at everyone should at least try to give it a ones read over so we all have at least some picture of the situation...

Leanah1 wrote:One think i like to add that might be self explanetory is that everyone should at least try to read up a bit on Tactic before the run. It might be hard to understanding everything but at everyone should at least try to give it a ones read over so we all have at least some picture of the situation...

Food buffs, flasks and preparing for the raids by reading about the boss tactics etc are all part of the preparations everyone should do before joining a raid imo. Food buffs and flasks may not be mandatory but the tactics are, imo.

Oh and Tesh, I'm gonna be a healer, remember? I'll lurk around the shaman forums and make sure I'm ready when I start heroics.

Well another Nax is behind us. We made it nearly to the end of third wing and my thoughts on the subject are following:

1. With Gredeth we have our healers covered (he really outdone himself today and showed truly excellent performance). He had doubts in himself yesterday but I hope they are gone today

2. 2 bosses still pose problems -
Anub rekhan - but I think we got that covered by changing the healing tactics
The dirty dancer - people still need to get it laid down and not die (at least 5 should survive to bring him down easily and without taking too much time)

3. Our DPS is still slacky. So i would ask all of our DPS classes to look more into their rotations and such, to maximize their output. If all have done it I guess its a gear issue and it'll sort itself out

4. Still too much downtime between bosses, and too much wipes. We HAVE to move faster. In reality I think about 50 mins to clear wing is more then enough and ill give us 5 or 10 min break between wings.

your thoughts on subject??

Well my doubts are gone. I was worried I'd run OOM too fast but with the flask and correct use of Mana Tide I can keep healing long enough. During the first trash pulls and in the start of Heigan I was still a bit nervous etc etc but I got it down pretty fast and boy did I have fun

1. Heigan
Took a few wipes but I think we did pretty well here. People still need to learn the Heigan Dance and that's really all there is to it, easy boss and probably my favourite Things that helped me get the dance down: 1. When moving to the left and right areas of the room (areas "1" and "4"), you only need to take a few steps. If you run too far, you'll have trouble turning back fast enough.

2. Loatheb
This guy was incredibly easy! I had my doubts when we entered the room but all in all there were only a few times where the raid dropped dangerously low and even then a precasted Chain Heal + insta Chain Heal fixed things nicely

3. Instructor Razuvious
Got confused with the healing targets and accidentally healed the tanks themselves first Marking the Understudy tanks helped a lot and seems like we got through, nothing too complicated here.

4. Gothik the Harvester
This guy was fun, the chaos... I was a bit confused about this boss when I read the tactics but it wasn't that bad after all. A few "oh SHI-" moments but what would raiding be without those..?

Xanaxorch, the mage (hope I got the name right), said he'd love to go again if we ever need to fill DPS spots and if he happens to be online at the same time. What do you think? Should we take him? He's also finnish and was a bit uncertain of the tactics on some bosses but it's really easy for me to explain them to him as long as he's done a bit of research himself.

Great run, I had fun ( lols ), let's go again asap!

PS.

With Gredeth we have our healers covered (he really outdone himself today and showed truly excellent performance)

Oh Tesh, you're making me blush!

I have a question regarding some loot.. I had a look at the bosses' drops already so there won't be any confusing moments for me when we're raiding and stumbled upon this ring from Maexxna Timeworn Silken Band . Maexxna also drops another ring that's much much more suitable for me but I just wanted to ask in advance if it's ok if I roll on Timeworn Silken Band? The +spirit doesn't really benefit me in any way but the other stats are exactly the ones I'm looking for. Your opinion on me rolling on that ring, please!

Gredeth wrote:Your opinion on me rolling on that ring, please!

Well your right on the fact that its more of a DPS caster ring but imo i say go for it if you can use it then you should need it.... And if the other boys beening meen to you about it send them to me...

On the other subjekts about the raids. It looks like it went pretty well for you guys. Heigen is hard but ones you get the timeing its mutch easier and we will get there i am sure.
About the dps i posted somthing in "Class" that might help use be better dps but i most say the the key to good dps is the rotation you can increas you dps alot by finding a good rotation.

About the other mage you where talking about i say let in guild members first and if thers room and you all think hes good then let him join...But befor we do that you need answer an crusal question .... Is he more powerful or pretty then me?.... For me this is a dealbreacker...

On Sunday I played like an idiot and if I'm honest I shouldn't even have logged on. I wasn't feeling too well and my head was totally NOT in the zone, the Heigan dance thing is ridiculously easy but I kept screwing it up grrrrrr. I was just about a 100% f-ck up on that one.

Glad things went well after my departure though and Gred mate - you put me to shame in healing you really do, amazing stuff well done. In my defence I have to pre-cast most of my healing as I've very little in the way of instants, which is also the reason I overheal so much (well that's my excuse anyway ).

I found the 'too much healing' thing on that frist boss quite interesting though - I'm sure tactics shouldn't revolve around my reliance on keeping Tesh up via Beacon of Light and other injured part members - but it does work really well I think.

About the other mage you where talking about i say let in guild members first and if thers room and you all think hes good then let him join...But befor we do that you need answer an crusal question .... Is he more powerful or pretty then me?.... For me this is a dealbreacker...

Of course I meant we'd invite him only if we need random DPS spots filled! Can't say about how powerful he is, seems to do a good job but prettier? No way! He's undead, you see..